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Author	Message
K259	Wednesday 21 April 2004 7:17:33 am I don't like nulls..(0's)..it's frustrating to see my expectations for the day go dark with no comments on my postings, and I don't find any solutions to the problems in the eZ publish documentation either. Maybe I just shall start to admire the zero's, because the summer is just around the corner, and I actually don't care anymore about sitting in front of the computer. Yes, I know. Irony, always irony..I'm stuck in front of the computer, I love it, and the job has to be done ;) If I could, I should have answered all these questions, but sorry. So, what can we do to get some more action in this forum? What about giving out prices for the best question pr.week, and the best and most creative and useful answer pr. week?
Dominik Pich	Thursday 22 April 2004 12:29:28 am maybe doing it like like sun forums or experts-exchange is an option?! Or corporating with EE? The igea of those sites is: Questioners have to assign points to their questions, giving them a value. Users answer them to get points to be able to ask questions themself
Eirik Alfstad Johansen	Thursday 22 April 2004 7:56:24 am I totally agree with Zinistry. Before Dominik answered a huge amount of posts earlier today (great job, BTW!) there were more 0's than other numbers on the forum main page, and this is nothing out of the ordinary. I think some sort of ranking system is a good idea. Personally, I got a little excited when the community stats page was launched, and I found myself among the top 20 most active forum authors. And there I intend to stay. :) A simple, yet effective solution might be to display the number of posts by the author in association with each forum post. This would of course increase the load on the template parser, but I think it could be worth it. Also, the forum traffic might increase now that one has been allowed to post their URLs. Hopefully, developers using the ez platform will wish to expose their knowledge. Personally, I try to answer the posts again, but of course my activiy varies depending on my work load. Also, there are several posts which I'm simply unable to answer, due to the extend of my knowledge related to ezp. This is where I think the ezp crew should be better at stepping in. I do realize that ez can spend too much time on this as there's no direct payoff, but they might consider targeting the more advanced users, allowing them to become more knowledgable and in turn, helping those who are less familiar with the ez platform. Finally, I've also noticed several posts that are left unanswered, either because the initial post is hard to understand, the author has poor english skills, or because the author could easily have figured this out by him-/herself. Though most people of the ez community take pride in providing comprehensive answers, sometimes it might be better with one lines explaining where one can find more information. Sincerely, Eirik Johansen http://www.netmaking.no/ Sincerely, Eirik Alfstad Johansen http://www.netmaking.no/
Alex Jones	Thursday 22 April 2004 8:30:18 am I would love to see more activity in the forums myself. I too do my best to answer as many questions as my workload allows. In large part this is because I had so much help from others when I was learning the system. For that matter, I still get a lot of help from these boards. While the idea of recognizing those who contribute is good, I'm not sure that it will truly make much of a difference. Those of us who want to help are going to help either way, sure, we like to be noticed, but I don't think that is the main reason we lend a hand. Personally I think a some things need to fall into place to noticeably improve these forums: <b>1. Documentation needs to be improved</b> I know this isn't forum related, but as noted above, many of the questions asked here can, or should be answered by the documentation. But frankly, the documentation is still hard to navigate and leaves many holes. I am able to answer many questions purely because I know how to find the right documentation page. More to the point, I know what terms to use in a search. New users don't have the same background, so they do not understand how to phrase a search to an answer to their question. If the documentation could be improved, we should see less of the basic questions, allowing people to spend more time on the complicated ones. Improving the documentation will require more than changing the structure of that area. Some time really needs to be spent on the terminology used throughout. There are some really confusing overlaps, most notable being the use of the term 'Section' to denote a container or grouping of information <b>and</b> a tag used to logically display data within a template. When I search for 'Section' I end up with a large amount of results that don't lead me to the answer I seek. Please note, I think the information in the documentation is extremely helpful, and I appreciate the fact that the folks at eZ systems have done a lot of hard work on it. I just think it could use some changes to make it better. <b>2. Dedicated community staff</b> A while back eZ systems promised to have a staff member dedicated to the community, but as far as I am aware, none has been announced. So, the involvement of the developers comes and goes like the tide. When they do pop in they are immensely helpful. When they are not around, some questions just cannot be answered. We all know they are busy, but ultimately their involvement in this forum has a direct impact on the use of eZ publish in corporate environments. So, while I like the idea of assigning points/karma/status to those people who answer questions, I think these underlying issues would go a long way to improving the system. Alex Alex [ bald_technologist on the IRC channel (irc.freenode.net): #eZpublish ] <i>When in doubt, clear the cache.</i>
Paul Forsyth	Thursday 22 April 2004 8:34:22 am I haven't been happy with the situation either, so I spoke with bård from ez about this. Their plans for the community have been ruined by their workload. In addition to paying customers they trying to get 3.4 out of the door and are fixing lots of bugs. Unfortunately this has resulted in the lack of posts to the forums. They are aware of this and want to use the conference to turn around this situation. Roadmaps for 3.5 and ez.no will likely be put together as a result of discussions and workshops from the conference. I hope this helps to fill the knowledge gap a little. paul
Paul Forsyth	Thursday 22 April 2004 8:41:09 am I just posted this in the suggestions area: http://ez.no/community/forum/suggestions/forum_moderators_flag_topics_for_ez_to_look_at Might be one way of targetting ez resources at unanswered questions... paul
Georg Franz	Thursday 22 April 2004 8:49:32 am Hi, [irony on] At the moment, the only way to get in touch with the ez crew is to report a bug ... and because of this, I don't put suggestions in the forum but in the bug report ;-) [irony off] Yes, a kind of "FAQ" would be a great idea. Maybe the easiest way to get this work is to extend the "forum message" with keywords which can be only editet by moderators. And the system will find related topics / answers automaticly? Kind regards, Emil. Best wishes, Georg. -- http://www.schicksal.com Horoskop website which uses eZ Publish since 2004
Alex Jones	Thursday 22 April 2004 9:09:03 am Also, perhaps there could be an alternate view of the forum that only displays unanswered questions... That way, when someone has a bit of extra time they can take a quick look at that view and see if there are any posts that they can answer. Alex Alex [ bald_technologist on the IRC channel (irc.freenode.net): #eZpublish ] <i>When in doubt, clear the cache.</i>
Trond Åge Kvalø	Friday 30 April 2004 4:12:52 am Hi, all! These forums have been indispensable for me in developing my first ez-publish site. And I know that I too will try to answer questions whenever I have the opportunity. But it's a fact that we can't dismiss that some people tend to think "what's in it for me?" whenever there's talks about getting things done. So anything to satisfy that question would probably benefit the forums. The stats page is cool of course, but I felt a bit bad about the other month when I was among the top three for that month. I think at least 80% of my "contributions" were questions and not answers. It didn't feel right to be credited for "nagging" ;-) Maybe you could get credited more for answers than for questions? Not sure how that could be implemented though, but maybe it could be worth a thought. Just my two cents. trondåge trondåge
Dominik Pich	Friday 30 April 2004 6:35:03 am Woa, a stats page :) Never noticed... not of any use anyways imo
James Packham	Friday 30 April 2004 6:57:12 am Is it that bad?? I thought the forums were quite good myself! I always seem to get answers :) Mind you I never tend to ask anything too difficult, because I prefer to work it out myself. I think it's the case (realistically) that nobody is going to go out of their way to figure out the answer to your questions - i.e. if they don't know (because you haven't full explained your problem), or it'd take a long time to explain, they probably won't answer in most forums. I'm not saying there's nothing you can do to improve the forums, but to be honest you'll never get the same level of support from a free forum as you will from paying the ez crew. ~James~ p.s. talking about the quality of forums, it seems kind of ironic that this thread is in the wrong forum :)
Dominik Pich	Wednesday 05 May 2004 1:03:55 am I dont expect all my questions to be answered but at least some... We have a stats page - fine - but it helps not a bit I keep answering questions but mine are seldom answer... on the last 7 were 0 replies :( Under these conditions bye bye p.s. It is about this forum's actity so the post is in the correct forum IMO p.s. MODs and eZStaff should react
Paul Forsyth	Wednesday 05 May 2004 1:20:38 am Unfortunately, not all questions can be answered all of the time. Moderators are just people who have been on the forums for a long period of time but they cant be here constantly. I gave a reason for the absence of eZ earlier on this thread which i have decided to accept until the conference, which is only a month away. I very much hope the conference will renew the activity here by eZ. I've been led to believe this will happen. That said, I find it hard to answer some posts on the forums. It is too often the case that the problem has not been properly described, or the given answer is not understood by the original poster. This mismatch in knowledge is, for me, one of the biggest reasons questions cannot be properly resolved. I see a few ways forward, which i posted as suggestions: http://ez.no/community/forum/suggestions/troubleshooting_wizard http://ez.no/community/forum/suggestions/ez_no_template_evaluator But, so far no one has replied ;) paul -- http://www.visionwt.com
Alex Jones	Wednesday 05 May 2004 7:22:38 am While it is frustrating to not have questions answered, quitting over the issue doesn't help either. This community has grown by people sticking it out, often times having to ask a question more than once. Were you to look through old posts you would see a lot of threads that I kept posting to in the hopes that I someone would provide an answer. You will also see posts where people have answered their own questions and were kind enough to post their discoveries for others. As Paul mentioned, often questions aren't phrased well, or the answer will require a lot of time to explain in sufficient detail. Other times it comes down to the frustration of seeing questions that have been answered several times already (please note, I am not implying that your questions fall into this category Dominik). A third reason that a question may not be answered is the lack of specific knowledge or experience by forum participants. For example, I know next to nothing about the translation system as I haven't had a business reason to make use of it. So, I cannot provide answers to those types of questions. Luckily, others on the forums strive to provide those answers. Finally there are questions that the community just can't answer for a variety of reasons. Individual members of the community have very different needs and projects. While I personally believe that the eZ systems crew should be more consistently involved in the forums, I also believe that we, as members of this community, need to recognize when it is time to purchase and use the available support contracts. We may feel that our question should be answered for free, but if we need an answer that the forum can't provide, then we need to go to the source. It is the cost of providing professional services and should be built into any major project. Even more importantly, we should be willing to provide the recently purchased knowledge to the community as a whole when we can. A lot of the information posted on these forums, and in the contributions section are due in part to people sharing the answers and knowledge they received via the support contracts. Everyone here has questions that go unanswered, moderators included. Frankly, I have yet to see any Web community have a perfect score on providing answers to posted questions. It just isn't possible with a tool that covers so many possible projects as this one does. This isn't an excuse, as I think we, as a community should aim to answer everything, but it is the reality of the situation. Again, quitting over a lack of answers solves nothing. Alex Alex [ bald_technologist on the IRC channel (irc.freenode.net): #eZpublish ] <i>When in doubt, clear the cache.</i>
Willie Seabrook	Wednesday 05 May 2004 3:58:06 pm A key question I think needs to be asked is "Is ez Publish actually still getting as many new users as it used to???" The product and community feels like its in decline already.... which I find a bit worrying personally. What are people using instead of ezPublish these days? I havn't kept up with the market much so I'm not up with the play. Is the total implementation of cms's declining or is it just ez? Or am I completely wrong? :-) I'd suggest the following might help to rectify the forums situation: 1. Three levels of forum membership. 1.1 Basic (like most people now) 1.2 Blogger (the new one) 1.3 Moderator. Probably once or twice a week I end up hacking ez Publish a bit and adding cool new stuff... like real phpAds integration, a solid bulk mail system etc etc. I don't have the time to document it properly and submit to svn but perhaps if I had the ability to log into my blog, post a paragraph intro, paste in the code and submit... I'd have time to submit all the mods I do to the community. Just an idea... even just a forum dedicated to hacks and mods. Something less formal than the current system. Another thing with the forums is that the ez Systems guys used to participate a lot more. I'll sum up with this point as I think its by far the most important. The experienced members on the forum (especially myself who selfishly hasn't posted in ages) need to pump up the support a little. Regards, Willie
Willie Seabrook	Wednesday 05 May 2004 4:11:39 pm Paul Forsyth & Alex Jones.... please pop me an email at: willie dot seabrook at levity dot co dot nz I'd take the initiative but don't have your email addresses!
Aleksander Farstad	Thursday 06 May 2004 1:16:35 am Hi Everybody, Yes, we admit that we have not had too much time to use in the forums. There are mainly two reasons for this, one is the increased demand from larger paying customers and the second is more resources put into eZ publish development. And we admit that these two things have been prioritized, both because we need to make a living and for the best of all of us and for eZ publish, we are running very strict development processes for eZ publish, and don't want to take resources from this development. But we admit that the community activities are important for the popularity of eZ publish. We know that we need to help you accomplish more. This will improve as we get our new staff onboard and more resources for community activities. I also admit that we will be very busy up until the 3.4 release in beginning of June, but things will improve after that time. I hope you all can hang in there and help each other, and remember that we still keep an eye on the forum and listen to your feedback and suggestions. -Aleksander
Hardy Pottinger	Thursday 11 November 2004 11:36:10 am Hi, an observation: as long as you keep relying on a PULL (a forum) instead of a PUSH (mail list), you've got an inherent barier to participation. I know mail lists aren't as sexy as some wizbang web application, but I can tell you that the biggest communities on the net, the biggest body of working knowledge, comes from something other than a forum. Can you succeed without a mail list? Sure. But it's a heck of a lot easier if you have one. But, as long as we're talking about eZPublish communities, there's a post over at the FreshMeat entry for eZPublish (http://freshmeat.net/projects/ezpublish/) that has me intrigued. someguy AT firebright DOT com says "eZPublish has a lot of smaller communities," and also mentions the IRC channel. I've dropped in on the IRC channel, but haven't spent much time there. Pretty quiet. What intrigues me is the reference to other communities. If anyone is familiar with what this might refer to, can you post URLs here? I've Googled a bit, but haven't found the magic keywords, I'm afraid. I'm really looking forward to the new documentation. The book is an outstanding resource, just wish it had a better index...
Tore Jørgensen	Saturday 27 November 2004 11:05:20 pm http://www.ezpub.co.uk/ is one.
Bruce Morrison	Sunday 28 November 2004 2:51:14 pm I think http://www.ezpub.co.uk/ is dead: http://forum.ezpub.co.uk/showthread.php?p=326#post326 My Blog: http://www.stuffandcontent.com/ Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/brucemorrison Consolidated eZ Publish Feed : http://friendfeed.com/rooms/ez-publish